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DennisMCSE

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Reply with quote  #1 
Not sure how I missed this before, but it seems that when Intel releases their Skylake processors this summer, the only Windows operating system that will work on it is Windows 10. Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 won't be supported. Not that it is necessarily a bad thing.

http://www.theverge.com/2016/1/16/10780876/microsoft-windows-support-policy-new-processors-skylake
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wkasdo

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Reply with quote  #2 
With the exception of certain business PCs that will support Win7 and Win81 until mid 2017: https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/64112/microsoft-publishes-initial-lists-of-skylake-compatible-pcs-for-businesses.
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JamesNT

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Reply with quote  #3 
Well, that's one way to move everyone forward.

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gjcooper

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Reply with quote  #4 
and we thought politicians were corrupt. Here's two of the biggest companies locking business into each other. Sink or Swim.
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jsclmedave

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Reply with quote  #5 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gjcooper
and we thought politicians were corrupt. Here's two of the biggest companies locking business into each other. Sink or Swim.

Corrupt..?

How is moving forward with new technology corrupt?

Should they still support NT ?

If you want this then new shiny thing that is AWESOME! use A.  

If you cannot live without your XP then use B...

Unless I am totally missing your point, I don't see this as an issue but a platform requirement going forward...




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cspanburgh

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Reply with quote  #6 
Could it be that many of the older chipset standards are so well known in the black hat world, that they are exploited.

This would be a "Stake in the ground" to move forward move security forward.

That being said it makes many tools that were DOS and UNIX based where you could access the hardware directly.   So it's an opportunity to move ahead.

Regarding companies getting together to set technology standards, this has been going on since the EMM396 days.

So this move for me is just another "Childhood's End".

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donoli

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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
Could it be that many of the older chipset standards are so well known in the black hat world, that they are exploited.


It could be but probably isn't. Black Hats exploit software & mistakes in coding, far more than hardware. Deals between software & hardware manufacturers are usually financial decisions.  Whenever the question is why, the answer is money.  That goes for anything not just computers.
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wobble_wobble

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Reply with quote  #8 
Certain amount is advances in hardware.
Certain amount is copyright protection enhancements
Certain amount is security and security enable mentioned.
And maybe 50% is commercial☺

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Mark Minasi

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Reply with quote  #9 
And I'm having trouble with the basic problem.
  • You're buying a new computer for some reason.
  • You're going to put nothing earlier than Win 7 on it.  
  • If you ARE, just fire up the free Hyper-V server that comes with your Windows 10 Pro and set the processor to "emulation mode."
  • You can now (for some reason) load Windows XP.
The Skylake stuff is pretty cool -- in particular the Guards.
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donoli

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Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
If you ARE, just fire up the free Hyper-V server that comes with your Windows 10 Pro and set the processor to "emulation mode. You can now (for some reason) load Windows XP.


In that case, can a non Windows OS be installed OR will secure boot stop it?  I thought about buying a Win 10 Pro Lenovo but the sales dept. couldn't answer the secure boot question.  The sales girl said that she would email me with the answer.  The email said to contact the tech dept.  I responded.  Why do I have to do your work to make the sale for you?  I called tech support anyway & they told me to contact sales.  I said that sales told me to talk to you. Now you're telling me to talk to them. Maybe I'll call the president of Lenovo at his home #. I'm sure that he'll tell me to call sales.
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Mark Minasi

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Reply with quote  #11 
You don't boot your computer from a guest VM.  You run the guest VM as a virtual machine and run whatever software you want -- if you've got a Linux utility, fire up a Ubuntu VM and run that software.
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donoli

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You don't boot your computer from a guest VM.


That's correct but the VM has to boot too. Secure Boot may cover both. Secondly, can UEFI block the non Windows OS, in the VM?
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Mark Minasi

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Reply with quote  #13 
Forgive me, Anonymous Guy, but I guess I was unclear. [smile]

  • Virtual machines created under Hyper-V get (of course) virtual processors.
  • If I understand you right, you fear that a Skylake system wouldn't be able to run a Pre-Win 7 (or possibly Linux... it's really hard to imagine that Intel would sell a line of chips that don't support Linux!)
  • A Hyper-V child VM gets one of two kinds of processors -- either a copy of your physical processor, or a generic Pentium processor.  It's a setting in Hyper-V management.
  • Thus, you should be able to (1) Build a VM in Hyper-V, (2) give it the generic processor, and (3) thus be able to install, boot and run a VIRTUAL machine running the old/non-Windows OS.
  • Additionally, virtual machines have virtual firmware that can be either BIOS or UEFI.  In fact if I recall right, any Generation 1 VM has a BIOS, not a UEFI.  Your Hyper-V server's firmware has nothing at all to do with any child VM firmwares and in fact the introduction of Gen 2 VMs in  2012R2 was welcomed because we could finally create Secure Boot VMs.
  • Remember, merely having UEFI firmware does NOT guarantee that your firmware supports Secure Boot... SB requires UEFI, but UEFI does not necessarily offer SB.  (I have several circa-2010 systems that have UEFI but no Secure Boot, as SB support only appeared in Windows in 8 -- there is to my knowledge no way to create a Secure Boot Windows 7.
Apologies if I answered the wrong question -- post back if it's still unclear.

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donoli

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Reply with quote  #14 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_Extensible_Firmware_Interface#Implementation_and_adoption

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Following the release of Windows 8 in late 2012, it was discovered that certain Lenovo computer models with secure boot had firmware that was hardcoded to allow only executables named "Windows Boot Manager" or "Red Hat Enterprise Linux" to load, regardless of any other setting.


That's a quote from the wikipedia site.  My question to Lenovo was, does that include VMs?  They couldn't give me an answer.  You seem to be saying that it doesn't. I planned to buy a new desktop with Win 10 installed, from the factory.  However, I'm considering a clone with a Win 10 retail version so I can choose the motherboard & BIOS. It would be $300 more but I'll have what I want not what they give me.
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Mark Minasi

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Reply with quote  #15 
Again, let me re-iterate:  your system's firmware has no control of or effect upon any virtual machines you might run on a hypervisor on that system.  None whatsoever.

It's like saying that you're moving into a log cabin, but you're concerned that you'll only be able to build Lego houses with log legos.
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